diff --git a/crates/effects/src/group.rs b/crates/effects/src/group.rs
index 0e37be9ded..d2a6687dd7 100644
--- a/crates/effects/src/group.rs
+++ b/crates/effects/src/group.rs
@@ -832,13 +832,15 @@ pub fn evaluate_container(doc: Option<&Document>, n: &Node) -> Option<Node> {
         return None;
     }
     let mut m = n.clone();
-    // Its ruler guides take no part: they go back above the evaluated art at the end.
-    let mut guides = m.children_mut().map(|ch| ch.split_off(Node::guide_run_start(ch))).unwrap_or_default();
-    // So do its other guides and those in its sublayers and groups, which would otherwise go with
-    // the art the effects replace or copy: they stay on `n`, hidden and locked as their containers
-    // were.
+    // Its ruler guides take no part: they go back above the evaluated art at the end. With effects
+    // that replace or copy the art, so do its guides among the art and those in its sublayers and
+    // groups, which would otherwise go with that art: they stay on `n`, in order, hidden and
+    // locked as their containers were.
+    let mut guides = vec![];
     if pathfinder || !fx.is_empty() {
         take_sublayer_guides(&mut m, &mut guides, &Node::is_ruler_guide);
+    } else if let Some(ch) = m.children_mut() {
+        guides = ch.split_off(Node::guide_run_start(ch));
     }
     if pathfinder {
         let hook = |c: &Node| crate::outline_object(doc, c);
diff --git a/crates/effects/src/group/tests.rs b/crates/effects/src/group/tests.rs
index b2b802cc44..50fbf8f759 100644
--- a/crates/effects/src/group/tests.rs
+++ b/crates/effects/src/group/tests.rs
@@ -1998,6 +1998,35 @@ fn a_ruler_guide_in_a_group_survives_its_containers_effects() {
     }
 }
 
+/// The ruler guides of a layer or group with a Pathfinder effect or Transform copies, one among
+/// its art and one after it, go after the evaluated art in the order they were in.
+#[test]
+fn a_containers_ruler_guides_keep_their_order_through_its_effects() {
+    use vectorcraft_doc::LayerColor;
+    let guide = |id| Arc::new(Node::new(NodeId(id), NodeKind::RulerGuide { vertical: false, pos: 3.0, artboard: None }));
+    for (effect, params) in [("pathfinder.add", serde_json::json!({})), ("distort.transform", serde_json::json!({"moveH": 30, "copies": 2}))] {
+        let members = || vec![sq(1, 0.0, Color::BLACK), guide(20), sq(2, 5.0, Color::BLACK), guide(21)];
+        let fx = Effect { id: effect.into(), params: params.clone(), visible: true };
+        let mut l = Node::layer(NodeId(10), "Layer 1", LayerColor::Preset(0));
+        if let Some(ch) = l.children_mut() {
+            *ch = members();
+        }
+        l.appearance.effects.push(fx.clone());
+        let mut g = Node::group(NodeId(11), members());
+        g.appearance.effects.push(fx);
+        for (what, n) in [("layer", l), ("group", g)] {
+            let art = evaluate_container(None, &n).unwrap();
+            let mut all = vec![];
+            ruler_guides_in(&art, &mut all);
+            let ids = all.iter().map(|(id, ..)| *id).collect::<Vec<_>>();
+            assert_eq!(ids, [NodeId(20), NodeId(21)], "{effect} on a {what}: the guides, in order");
+            let ch = art.children().unwrap();
+            let tail = ch[ch.len() - 2..].iter().map(|c| c.id).collect::<Vec<_>>();
+            assert_eq!(tail, [NodeId(20), NodeId(21)], "{effect} on a {what}: last, in order");
+        }
+    }
+}
+
 /// A group's own Fill + Offset Path below its contents follows the outline of a clip group among
 /// its members, its clipping path, not the clipped art it hides outside that path (#7289).
 #[test]